Scrapped Zones And More

20 posts in this topic

Posted · Report post

I was poking around in the Alpha Team files tonight, and found several things I wasn't expecting.

CATEGORYIMAGES.TXT:

0	lego
41	group1
42	group2
43	group3
44	group4
45	group5
46	group6
35	ogel
1	global
19	trop
36	sub
37	sea
38	polar
39	mtn
40	moon
Notice the last six entries there? They're the zones in the game, in the order they're played through... Except the final game only has the first four listed there. This file lists two zones that didn't make the final cut: Mountain and Moon. Seeing as the other four zones are listed in the order they're played through, I think it's safe to say that the Mountain zone would have come after the Polar (Arctic) zone, and the Moon zone would have been the final set of levels in the game.

But wait, there's more.

CATEGORYUNITS.TXT

#BUILDING BLOCKS
ba0000	Baseplat	35
ba0001	Columns		35
ba0005	Sphere		35
ba0011	Walkway		35
ba0012	Plate		35
ba0013	Block		35
ba0014	Object		35
ba0015	Small Object	35
ba0034	Goody		35
ba0036	80S x 36	35
ba0037	80S x 72	35
ba0038	160Sx 36	35
ba0039	160Sx 72	35
ba0040	40S x 36	35
ba0041	480Sx 71	35

#CYBERIA
cy1000	Baseplat	
cy9001	Cylinder	
cy9021	20x20 A		
cy9022	20x20 B		
cy9023	20x20 C		
cy9024	12x10 A		
cy9025	12x10 B		
cy9026	12x10 C		
cy9031	Rotator		
cy9032	Hover		
cy9051	W Walk		
cy9052	N Walk		
cy9053	W Walk L	
cy9054	N Walk L	
cy9061	Portal		

#BADDIES
og9999	audio	35
b0001	Ogel		35
b0002	B Guard		35
b0003	B Sentry		35
b0004	Wk Radia	35
b0006	Wk Assem	35
b0007	Wk Cart		35
b0008	B Follower	35
mf0003	B Neandert	35
b0009	B Plant		35

#OGEL UNITS
og0001a	Plasm Bm	35
og0001b	Plasm Bt	35
og0002a	Door Lev	35
og0002b	Lever Act	35
og0003	Doorway		35
og0004	Panel 1		35
og0004a	Panel 2		35
og0004b	Panel 3		35
og0004c	Panel 4		35
og0005	Box Ship	35
og0007	Zapper		35
og0014	Orb		35
og0015	Door Mot	35
og0015b	MotAct		35
og0016a	Door El		35
og0016b	Elect Act	35
og0017a	Door Til	35
og0017b	Tile Act	35
og0018a	Door Las	35
og0018b	Las Act		35
og0019a	Door Pln	35
og0019b	Plung Act	35
og0020	Laser		35
og0032	Expl Crt	35
og0033	Teleport	35
og0034	Door Chl	35
og0035	Door Cmp	35
og0036	Rock		35
og0037	Expl Wal	35
og0038	Expl Bar	35
og0040	Ladder	35
og0041	Sm Stairs	35	
og0042	Tl Stairs	35	
og0043	Shark 35	
og0044	Ice Wall	35
og0046	pump	35
og0048	cell	35
og0049	train	35
og0050	doom	35
og0051	polar	35
og0056	box2	35
og0057	box5	35
og0058	bar2	35
og0059	bar3	35
og9999	Audio	35

#OGEL GLOBAL PROPS
p0001	crate	1
p0003	sm_rocks	1
p0004	me_rocks	1
p0005	lg_rocks	1
p0006	g_barrel	1
p0008	cr_rocks	1
p0012	lobby_dr	1
p0015	comp1	1
p0016	comp2	1
p0017	comp3	1
p0018	comp4	1
p0019	platfrm1	1
p0020	plat_box	1
p0021	platfrm2	1
p0022	tank1	1
p0023	Goo_Mac1	1
p0024	Goo_Mac2	1
p0025	barrels	1
p0026	platfrm3	1
p0027	Furnace	1
p0028	obs_room	1
p0029	platfrm4	1
p0030	cart	1
p0031	crates1	1
p0032	Lamp	1
p0033	Lockers	1
p0034	Bench	1
p0035	Pillar	1
p0036	Missile	1
p0037	Sub	1
p0038	telescop	1
p0042	arch	1
p0043	beam	1
p0044	chkbrd	1
p0045	box	1
p0046	btmgrate	1
p0047	cbox	1
p0048	console	1
p0049	big tank	1	
p0050	crate	1
p0050	crates2	1
p0051	crate2	1
p0052	gaspipe	1
p0053	grate	1
p0054	mount	1
p0055	oiltank	1
p0056	plungers	1
p0057	stack	1
p0058	mooring	1
p0059	tank2	1
p0060	tread	1
p0061	tread3	1
p0062	wcrate	1
p0063	belt	1
p0064	reactor	1
p0065	stamper	1
p0066	walk	1
p0067	train	1
p0068	tank3	1
p0069	door2	1
p0070	sm_orb	1
p0072	grate2	1
p0073	catwalk_	1
p0080	grate1	1
p0081a	beam10x2	1
p0081b	beamlong		1
p0082	railing1	1
p0083	railing2	1
p0084	door1	1
p0085	c_door1	1
p0086	c_door2	1
p0092	conveyor	1
p0093	pillar1	1
p0094	pillar2	1
p0095	crates3	1
p0098	train_bm	1
p0100	shaft1	1
p0100	shaft1	1
p0101	shaft2	1
p0101	shaft2	1
p0102	ConvRail	1
p0116	paint1	1
p0117	paint2	1
p0118	paint3	1
p0119	rail crn	1
p0120	rail sht	1
p0121	lowcrate	1

#OGEL UNDERSEA PROPS
p3001	g80x80	37
p3002	g80x320	37
p3003	g480x480 	37
p3004	g240x240 	37
p3005	g160x160	37
p3030	big shft	37
p0001	Shipping	37
p0006	goo barr	37
p0015	Computer	37
p0016	computer	37
p0017	computer	37
p0018	super co	37
p0022	TANK	37
p0023	Goo Mach	37
p0024	Goo Mach	37
p0025	goo barr	37
p0028	Obersvat	37
p0031	Crate St	37
p0033	Lockers	37
p0034	Bench	37
p0047	control 	37
p0048	Console	37
p0049	Big Tank	37
p0050	Crate St	37
p0059	Tall Tan	37
p0068	Tall Tan	37
p0082	guard ra	37
p0092	Wide Con	37
p0094	Thin Pil	37
p0095	crate St	37
p0105	Sub ASse	37
p1014	bLACKBOA	37
P1015	bLACKBOA	37
p2001a	Tube Cou	37
p2001b	Tube Cou	37
p2001c	Tube Cou	37
p2020	Goo Plan	37
p3007	HORIZONT	37
p3008	goo disp	37
p3009	H THIN P	37
p3010	psgwy	37
p3013	V THIN P	37
p3017	CONV SHI	37
p3022	wall lig	37
p3024	vgootube	37
p3028	vredpipe	37

#OGEL SUBTERRANEAN PROPS
p0080	grate1	36
p2021	grate2	36
p2022	grate3	36
p2023	grate4	36
p0072	grate6	36
p0073	catwalk	36
p0074	ledge1	36
p0075	ledge2	36
p0076	ledge3	36
p2010	ledge4	36
p2011	corner	36
p2012	pillar1	36
p2013	pillar2	36
p2014	pillar3	36
p2015	pillar4	36
p2002	walllamp	36
p2003	st_lamp	36
p0071	crates_1	36
p0077a	minechut	36
p0077b	minechut	36
p0081a	smbeam	36
p0081b	bigbeam	36
p3007	h_gootub	36
p3024	v_gootub	36
p2001a	coupling	36
p2001b	coupling	36
p2001c	coupling	36
p0087a	h beam	36
p0087b	v beam	36
p0089	sm_vent	36
p0091	crate	36
p2004	crystal	36
p2005	drill	36
p2006	refinery	36
p0078	fog	36
p2017	Magma	36
p2020	goo	36

#OGEL TROPICAL ISLAND PROPS
p0126	shaft	19
p1001	grate1	19
p1005	grate2	19
p1004	grate3	19
p1003	grate4	19
p1017	gratecor	19
p1018	grateend	19
p1002	catwalk 	19
p1007	tank	19
p1008	heater	19
p1009	dispensr	19
p1010	foliage 	19
p1011	water	19
p1016	crates	19
p1017	grt crn	19
p1018	grt end	19
p1019	torch	19
p1020	pillar	19
p0016	comp2	19
p0017	comp3	19
p0018	comp4	19
p0050	crates2	19
p0052	gaspipe	19
p0060	tread	19
p0082	rail	19
p0084	bad door	19
p0085	c_door1	19
p0086	c_door2	19
p0092	conveyor	19
p0102	ConvRail	19
p0104	ConvPlt	19
p0119	rail crn	19
p0120	rail sht	19
p0121	crt low	19

#OGEL POLAR PROPS
p4013	floor1	38
p4014	floor2	38
p4016	sq_floor	38
p4017	icicle	38
p4018	icestatu	38
p4019	icerocks	38
p4020	cubes	38
p4033	shaft	38
p4032	catwalk	38
p4012	water	38
p0122	flag	38
p0116	paint1	38
p0117	paint2	38
p0118	paint3	38
og0051	door	38

#OGEL MOUNTAIN PROPS

#OGEL MOON PROPS

#T.I.L.T.
t0001	Tee Vee		0
t0011	Motion		0	41
t0012	Electrical	0	44
t0013	Explode		0	42
t0014	Motor		0	45
t0015	Lasers		0	43
t0016	Rope		0	46

# LEGO UNITS							
									
u0004	Dive Brd	0	46		
U0016	Tower S		0	42
u0017	Catapult	0	43
u0022	Launcher	0	43
U0023	Trampolin	0	41
U0026	Puncher		0	42	
U0027	teeter		0	46
U0033	Slide		0	41
U0038	Cannon		0	43	
u0045	Pl Gen		0	44	
U0057	Nudgy		0	42
u0067	R Motor		0	46	
U0071	E Motor		0	45			
U0074	Pulley		0	46			
U0075	Asteroid	0	43
u0078	Yanker		0	46
u0123	Can Ball	0	43
u0132	V Mirror	0	43		
u0157	Motor Gen	0	45
u0164	Stairs		0	41		
U0165	Hanger		0	43
u0166	Las Gen		0	44
u0175	Pl Motor	0	45
u0177	JumpTile	0	41
u0179	Dir Tile	0	41
u0181	Belt Chg	0	45
u0184	Turbo Tube	0	44
u0186	V Punch		0	44
u0188	Antigrav	0	44
u0196	Ball		0	42
u0197a	Rmte Bomb	0	42
u0197b	Rmte Plng	0	42
u0198	Pl Laser	0	43
U0199	HvyBall		0	43
u0200	H Mirror	0	43
u0201	EjctSeat	0	45
u0204	MotLaser	0	45
U0206	see-saw		0	42

"Cyberia"? What the heck is that? Perhaps a leftover from LEGO Logic? There does seem to be some sort of portal in the TILT HQ, so perhaps that's what Cyberia is?

And there's a listing for a "Neandert" enemy, which is just a few letters away from "Neanderthal"... Who wants to bet it's the big blue primitive looking creature from LEGO Logic?

There's also sections for the scrapped Mountain and Moon zones... Which are completely empty.

Also, notice that the section listing all the Alpha Team members is titled "T.I.L.T.".

There's an asteroid of all things listed in the "LEGO UNITS" section, and a texture named "ASTEROID 2.TGA":

asteroid_2.png

At first I thought that perhaps the asteroids appear in the training... space place... But I just checked, and there are none. Perhaps they were for the Moon zone or something?

Another odd thing, Dash and Radia's texture names are pretty weird. Dash's textures are LASERBODY.TGA, LASERHEAD.TGA, etc, while Radia's textures are PIPBODY.TGA, PIPHEAD.TGA, etc. All the other team members are identified by specialty rather than name, so why are Dash's textures identifying him as the lasers expert, and what the heck does PIP mean?

Finally, there's a bunch of textures that appear to be for a debug GUI or something - buttons for each listing in CATEGORYIMAGES.txt, more finalized looking buttons for each zone (including the Moon zone, but not the Mountain zone, oddly), etc. There's quite a few so I won't be uploading them, if you want to see them for yourself they're in Etc.pac.

I'll keep digging around and will post anything else I find.

4 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

Nice findings here, very interesting indeed. Despite that asteroid texture not featuring in the game, I reckon they still used what they'd already started creating in the Moon theme to produce the training, although I'm probably wrong. It's just if I had made all that stuff, had to have it scrapped but was then later given the opportunity to use it again elsewhere, I would.

 

Perhaps PIP stands for Professional International Performer? That could make sense if her original role in the T.I.L.T was a gymnast.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

So, the asteroids.

legoat1_2013-04-29_12-20-34-00.png

Yeah. They're just those big rocks you drop on stuff. Why the heck are they called asteroids in these unit listings and textures, though?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

Nice observations. I was doing a little digging in these files a while back and remember seeing these things.

 

The biggest thing in LAT modding is yet to be model editing. I'm still working on the FIN format every now and again.

Once we can view and edit the models, we'll know a lot more about the game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

Just got an email back from Tom Mott, the lead designer for Alpha Team, and he sent a ton of info on LEGO Logic and T.I.L.T. and all that - and he's gonna contact some other developers and see if they can dig up concept art and the like, too. It's nearly 2:00 AM right now so I'm a bit too tired to really post much, but I do want to say one thing: The neanderthals are actually "neanderthaws", and they were found in a world called Mt. Fridgy. Other worlds in LEGO Logic included Aromazona and Poodle Dreamland.

This game was nuts, people.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

Someone should post this stuff to The Cutting Room Floor. It could use an Alpha Team page.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

Other worlds in LEGO Logic included Aromazona and Poodle Dreamland.This game was nuts, people.

 

This sounds insane. I want to play it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

Wow. Just... wow. Great job Jamesster, you seem to have found an awful lot about the game whilst making a whole team of people happy!

 

It's so nice to see how proud of the game the team members are, all these years later. It's also amazing to suddenly know so much about something that was discovered via a short video clip on YouTube.

 

About LEGO not liking the mixed theme concept... I can kind of understand the concerns they had. LEGO Racers was very much a "best-of" in regards to its choice of themes, and even then they excluded girls themes (though Belville and Scala wouldn't have fitted anyway). Earlier than that, Time Cruisers very much focused upon boys themes, including Fright Knights, Aquazone and Ice Planet 2002. By the looks of things, LEGO Logic seems a lot more ambiguous when it comes to its themes. Yes, I know they have the whole "household appliances" thing going on, but that's usually the focus for a level within an adventure game, not a whole game.

 

I've never played Alpha Team, but I loved the theme as a kid and a lot of the talk of it recently has gotten me interested.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

So much information! I can't respond to it all. I do love how Dash was based off that Tom guy, in order to persuade him to accept the design.

 

If you get any concept art, I may have to use it along with the animation they created to make the T.I.L.T. myself. I.e. using plain LEGO parts and applying decals on top. They'd be such a colourful collection of figures to have.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

Wow, that's really cool. I never knew that Alpha Team had that sort of history.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

I love Alpha Team and I think the secret agent thing worked really well. But this Logic thing looks like it could have been a lot of fun too. It's not like LEGO games using several unrelated themes have been uncommon.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

Thanks for sharing all of that information, jamesster. The happiness the developers seem to have experienced reminds me of the response when Templar first began posting concept art from Mata Nui Online Game - the developers were overjoyed to see that there were still people out there who remembered their work.

 

It seems I was correct when I theorized that LEGO Media called for a redesign at the last minute, although I had assumed that it would have been because they wanted the game to tie into the theme that LEGO would theoretically have been developing. I am sort of surprised that LEGO Media didn't monitor what Digital Domain was doing - they just approved the game concept and left the developers alone until a few months before the game was due to be completed? LEGO Media does not, to be completely honest, seem to have been terribly efficient. From what we have heard, they put a lot of unreasonable constraints and due dates on the developers, which is a shame.

 

The correlation between developers publishing LEGO games and their subsequent demise or decline is rather disturbing. I think that we have four cases now (LEGO Island and Mindscape, LEGO BIONICLE: The Legend of Mata Nui and Saffire, LEGO Universe and NetDevil (although that was not as much the end of NetDevil as the abrupt dismissal of the LEGO Universe team), and now this). Obviously there are plenty of companies that did not disband after developing LEGO games, but that fact that there are four examples seems astonishing.

 

The original concept for the game certainly sounds interesting. Using a flower pot and a dog pool as worlds is quite inventive, and it would have been interesting to see what Evil Ogel was doing attempting to thwart the way Minifigures operate household appliances. A random observation; the original premise explains the giant hotdog in the original introductory animation. Speaking of the animation, I wonder if there might have been some sort of world set inside a computer, judging by the scene with the construction worker-looking team member.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

A funny anecdote: When we redesigned the characters, we had a hard time getting Dash’s character design approved. I finally told the character designer to just make him look as much like the LEGO Executive Producer (Tom Gillo) as possible. Tom loved Dash’s new look—having no idea we were trying to make Dash look like him—and the character design was promptly approved.

Dash: http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20091221023428/lego/images/2/20/Dash.jpg

Tom Gillo: http://www.mobygames.com/images/portraits/small/1351474743-00.jpg

 

This is honestly just too freaking hilarious.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

Woah. Great job, James, you always manage to dig up interesting stuff.

I'd have loved to see the original project they were working on. If Alpha Team was great, how much greater would that unique project of theirs been?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

We should give you a new rank of "LEGO Informant" send you off into deep undercover missions, finding all the secrets about LEGO.

And also acquiring the source code for all the old classic LEGO games...

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

So Digital Domain was actually pretty far into development when LEGO took a look at it and its zany style and said "NOPE NOPE GOTTA MAKE IT 'COOLER' MAKE IT SERIOUS AND PUT BLACK AND BLUE EVERYWHERE"? Sounds a lot like what happened with LEGO Universe, how everything changed from Pre-Alpha.

Hold on a second, why is there no entry for "What could have been" on either of those TvTropes pages, Oh. It's in the Trivia. Never mind.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

I had no idea about that history and Alpha Team is my favorite theme! Thanks for doing all that digging Jamesster! On a side note, I've always thought Dash looked like another Tom, Tom Cruise. Hey, at least I got the first name right :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

I had no idea about that history and Alpha Team is my favorite theme! Thanks for doing all that digging Jamesster! On a side note, I've always thought Dash looked like another Tom, Tom Cruise. Hey, at least I got the first name right :)

Why are you always so thankful and happy? :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted · Report post

I had no idea about that history and Alpha Team is my favorite theme! Thanks for doing all that digging Jamesster! On a side note, I've always thought Dash looked like another Tom, Tom Cruise. Hey, at least I got the first name right :)

Why are you always so thankful and happy? :P

Is this wrong? I think we should all strive to be thankful and happy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now